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Post by Dinari Dollar on Feb 8, 2005 5:27:02 GMT -5
"The role of the government is to protect the people with a military and police, to run some services like the post office, and to educate people with public education. The government shouldn't meddle with people's lives. The government should just let people live."
"The government doesn't need to take care of people since most governments suck at that anyway. Charities can do that or organizations. It should be up to family, community, church, and organizations to care for people."
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Post by Korbinian Kautsky on Feb 8, 2005 5:32:25 GMT -5
"You sound almost like a libertarian. But continue it is interesting. So you believe in minimal government and that poor people should be take care of my charities, churches, family, and community. That sounds reasonable enough. I have no issue with how people are taken care of so long as they are taken care of. My main concern is that there seems to be economic factors that lead to the epidemic of poverty. I don't believe your solution addresses that."
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Post by Dinari Dollar on Feb 8, 2005 5:35:54 GMT -5
Dinari shakes his head. When talking with socialists of any kind, it always comes down to economics
"Yeah yeah, I have heard it before. The wealth of some is built on the exploitation of laborers. Well, duh, you don't have to tell me that. There are winners and losers in this game of life. You just want to make it so no one wins."
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Post by Korbinian Kautsky on Feb 8, 2005 5:38:03 GMT -5
"I am not some radical. I simply believe that if there are going to be winners and losers in this world, we should make rules so that the losers do not lose by so much. I also believe that there should be rules so everyone should have an equal opportunity to win. What is a game without rules?"
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Post by Dinari Dollar on Feb 8, 2005 5:43:21 GMT -5
"Rules are fine, but the kind of rules that you want make the winners out to be losers."
Dinari shifts in his seat.
"I hate how you socialists demonize a guy because he wants to have money or nice things. Or maybe he just isn't so idealistic. I know what the real world is like. Maybe your ideas sound good and nice for humanity, but they haven't worked once which should probably go to show that they are against the nature of humans. Humans are hunters and conquerers. We don't want harmony and equality. If we did, don't you think we would have had it by now? No, history is about war and conflict. And maybe some things change, but there are some major themes that don't."
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Post by Korbinian Kautsky on Feb 8, 2005 5:49:13 GMT -5
"I can sense that you have had many bad experiences with socialists, and you have every right not to trust me or what I have to say." Kautsky concedes.
"I think it is fine for a person to want nice things. But, I think there is a cut off point to excess. A person only needs so many luxuries."
"As for human nature, I don't agree with you. I am looking for a win win situation. Maybe Red Infinity or other socialisms have not worked, but democratic socialism worked well in Europe. Those countries enjoyed both freedom as well as a level of economic justice."
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Post by Dinari Dollar on Feb 8, 2005 5:54:20 GMT -5
"Maybe, but they also had high taxes and low production."
Dinari yawns.
"And maybe they had services for people, but everyone knows that government run services are poorer in quality than privately owned ones."
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Post by Korbinian Kautsky on Feb 8, 2005 5:56:48 GMT -5
"I think it this instance it is a matter of quantity versus quality. It doesn't matter how good medical care is if only a portion of society has access to it."
Kautksy didn't think he would run into so much trouble talking to this capitalist. He is not a revolutionary socialist and is pretty moderate politcally.
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Post by Dinari Dollar on Feb 8, 2005 5:57:30 GMT -5
"Yeah and it doesn't matter how much medical care is out there when you have to wait for months to access it."
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Post by Korbinian Kautsky on Feb 8, 2005 5:58:59 GMT -5
"I still think waiting is preferable than having none at all. But, if ever democratic socialism were re established in this world, that is something we could work on." Kautsky admits.
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Post by Dinari Dollar on Feb 8, 2005 6:02:50 GMT -5
"I have to get back to the mine. We can talk later."
Dinari dumps his leftovers into the trash and walks away.
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Post by Korbinian Kautsky on Feb 8, 2005 6:05:33 GMT -5
Kautsky watches Dinari leave and goes to his own room. He takes some strawberries from a dish in his closet. He won't have to work the rest of the day since he had made a secret deal with the guards.
"How can I win Dinari over to my side. Obviously he does not agree with me politically. I think I need to speak to him where he is at."
Kautsky eats a strawberry.
"To win his trust I have to give him some opportunity or chance at wealth. He has to see that by befriending me he is not compromising anything, but actually getting ahead in this world."
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Post by Dinari Dollar on Feb 8, 2005 6:07:03 GMT -5
Dinari is sent back down into the mine. He thinks little of what Kautsky said, but is upset that Kautsky can get better food and out of long hours of labor.
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Post by Korbinian Kautsky on Feb 8, 2005 6:08:17 GMT -5
Kautsky thinks long and hard of what he can to for Dinari.
"His money was taken from him. Maybe if I give him my home in Austria and somehow get him out of here he will be a future ally to me."
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Post by Dinari Dollar on Feb 8, 2005 6:09:24 GMT -5
Dinari works hard, and wonders what he is even mining for. Each day he is told to mine for these strange crystals. It strikes him as odd.
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